In a year that has seen trailblazing women rise to the occasion, another will be visiting Chicago.
Sandra Bernhard—a queer performer, actress, singer and author for five decades in the showbiz industry—will visit Chicago’s Park West on June 14 (as part of her “Shapes & Forms” tour) in a show that promises to entertain and educate. In a recent interview with Windy City Times, she discussed everything from the inspiration of the tour’s title to why she reveres the first two Godfather films.
Note: This conversation was edited for clarity and length.
Windy City Times: We are fellow Geminis—and I understand this is a milestone year for you.
Sandra Bernhard: It is! [Note: Bernhard turned 70 on June 6.]
WCT: At my age, I feel that every year is a milestone year. [Bernhard laughs.]
SB: It’s all good—interesting, complex but all good.
WCT: For sure. Where does the name “Shapes & Forms” come from?
SB: It comes from my mom. When we were driving from Michigan to Arizona when we moved out West (when I was 10), my mom was an abstract artist. When we were in New Mexico, she said, “Oh, my God—look at all the shapes and forms,” and we all laughed. After we settled in Arizona, she named her studio Shapes & Forms. That’s where that comes from.
WCT: You recently performed at [New York City’s] Cafe Carlyle, but I understand that place has a pretty unique policy about entertainers having to perform new material. I was wondering how the people there would even know that your material was new.
SB: I don’t know if that’s the normal policy but it seemed to be that way with me. I had just written “Shapes & Forms” and performed it at Joe’s Pub in December. But I said “okay” and basically wrote an entirely new show that I’ll do at Joe’s Pub next December. I don’t know if it’s a normal thing they do but people think that I can write 10 shows a year—which, apparently, I can. So I have material for next year. [Laughs]
I don’t think they could’ve known [about the newness of] the material but, honestly, I felt better about it. I feel like I did more songs than I’ve ever done. The show was a solid hour and a half—and that’s how long it’ll be in Chicago and the Midwest.
WCT: I love people who are original and quick-witted, like yourself, Fran Lebowitz and even Bianca del Rio. Would you say you’ve always been authentic or did you wake up one day and just say, “Look—this is who I am?”
SB: I never approached my work and my humor with defensiveness. There are a lot of reasons for being funny; I feel it’s natural and it’s been a way of surviving in a culture as a woman—sexually, politically and all the different aspects, I don’t know—it’s just a natural thing for me.
WCT: These days, it almost seems like coming out as LGBTQ+ is a political statement. What’s your take on that?
SB: I think the times we live in bring that out but I feel [coming out] should be a natural liberation for everyone. It shouldn’t be political but right now, it is. Trump’s bubbling cauldron of hate forces us to be political. To me, it’s regressive but it is what it is.
WCT: Until it is what it isn’t—and maybe his policies will be overturned.
SB: Well, of course they will—but it won’t happen overnight. But it’s not like trans people will suddenly be thrown out of the Armed Forces; if you want to, go ahead—but at the same time, you’re throwing valuable people to the curb. [Note: This talk took place before Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth instructed transgender servicemembers to self-identify for separation by June 6—July 7 for reservists—or face “involuntary separation.”] People are battling their own demons, and they’re taking it out on people who are comfortable in their own skin. It’s disgusting.
WCT: Can the audience at your show expect political discourse, or do you avoid politics altogether?
SB: Well, my work is inherently political and it captures the zeitgeist of whatever is happening. But I do not knock people over the head with the obvious; it’s not fun or engaging to get people worked up about what they’ve heard on MSNBC, NPR or their favorite outlet.
What I like to do is to put on a sophisticated, beautifully crafted show that uplifts people from their stress. At the same time, I want to bring them into a groovy moment that only I can create.
WCT: I saw where Bill Maher was supposed to interview you—but you turned it the other way around.
SB: Yeah—wasn’t that great?
WCT: I loved it. By the way, I didn’t know that you’re a fan of The Godfather and The Godfather Part II.
SB: They’re my absolutely favorite movies. I’ve literally seen each one a hundred times.
WCT: So what do you think of The Godfather Part III?
SB: Unfortunately, [Francis Ford Coppola] waited too long to do it and it just didn’t have the connective tissues that I and II have.
WCT: Switching gears, what is the secret to a long relationship? [Bernhard has been with partner Sara Switzer for 25 years.]
SB: Going back to things that are triggers for each person and going deeper into them until you fully mine the emotion and get as real as possible. Every relationship has sticking points. Stay in it and stay with it. One person might have a stronger reaction to something so you have to say, “Okay. This isn’t how I feel and I don’t really get it but if you’re doing it, then I need to get it.” But if you’re not thrilled with the person you’re with and you’re not connected, then it’s not going to work.
WCT: Did you want to add anything else?
SB: I think it’s always important for people who haven’t seen me to know that there’s a huge musical element to my shows. I always work with my musical director, Mitch Kaplan; we’ve been working together since the ‘80s. For these Midwest dates, we put together local musicians; I believe that I’ve worked with some of the Chicago musicians before.
It’s a whole show. It has nuance, and it has music, talking, singing, one-liners and stories. That’s what I specialize in—taking you on a journey. It’s like a cross-country trip; it’s like being in a car and listening to different songs while talking with your best friend.
To purchase tickets for Sandra Bernhard’s show, visit this link